Thibaut Courtois, Real Madrid's goalkeeper, gave an interview to Onda Cero. In the fifth part of this exclusive interview, Courtois discussed Real Madrid's performance, refereeing decisions, Manchester City FC's financial case, and the Negreira case.

How do you feel watching the game from behind the goal? When people ask how Real Madrid played, can you see it clearly from your goalkeeper position, or do you have a different perspective?

Yes, I can see it quite clearly. However, when the play is on the opposite end, it's harder to see where the spaces are because sometimes I think: "Pass it there, or pass it here." But of course, I can't see what they see up close.

That said, I think we played well. Against teams that defend deep, it's sometimes difficult for us to create more chances, but when the game opens up, we attack more and I think we create plenty of opportunities. Sometimes we just don't finish enough to make some games easier.

I thought we should have won away at Real Betis. Of course, they deserve credit too—their defense played very well, and both their goalkeeper and defenders did a good job. I think there are some games where we could have done better. In the match against Atlético Madrid, I think we lost more because of the red card and the penalty than for any other reason.

Speaking about referees, after you saw the replay, especially the clear foul by Lee Kang-in, what did you think after the game? The referees acknowledged it was a mistake and that he should have been sent off.

I think they acknowledged the mistake. At the end of the day, whether it's VAR or the main referee, I don't think they were at their best that day. But you see, it's not easy to see everything on the pitch clearly all the time. However, I saw one image where the referee was directly behind the play. Ultimately, you can see the leg was raised high, and Federico Valverde seemed to say something like: "He kicked hard," something like that.

So for me, you think: "Oh no, maybe he didn't see it." I understand, because I respect the referees and their job is really not easy at all. Even refereeing children's football is difficult.

Actually, I didn't see it immediately on the pitch because Federico Valverde signaled to play on at that moment. He might have wanted to keep the game flowing, so I didn't see it.

No, it was Federico Valverde—he stood up and turned directly to the referee as if to say "Didn't you see what happened?" because Federico Valverde went down and looked in pain at that moment. That's why I'm saying you're up in the stands, far away, but we're on the pitch and the referee is on the pitch too. Everyone is close together, and you feel like "Wait, something seems to have happened here."

For example, before Güler even restarted play, or even before the foul happened, they could have stopped the game and said: "Wait, I heard something." If VAR says: "Nothing, play on," then fine. That's their mistake. But I think now with VAR, often they make the game wait too long over unimportant things. So in that moment, you can see it's a collision and the players complain. I hope they can improve in the future.

But I still have to say that in that game we finished the first half at 0-0, and the real mistakes that made us lose that game were the penalty and the red card. Of course, we could have played better. It's not that we lost because of the referee. No, we lost because of our own mistakes. But clearly that's something that needs to be improved as well.

Do you think some Real Madrid fans believe the team has been treated unfairly by referees over the past few years? Is there a similar feeling in the dressing room?

It's hard to say. Sometimes yes, sometimes no. I don't think there's a "hidden hand" or anything like that. I'm not into conspiracy theories that big. But it is true that sometimes you feel things that would be called in other stadiums aren't called for us. On the flip side, things against us are called, but things that benefit us aren't.

For example, in the year of the pandemic, we ultimately lost the league title. I remember there were four handball decisions that season in the league. One was against Atlético Madrid, and after VAR intervened, they said: "That's a penalty."

Then there was one involving Nacho where the ball hit the back of his body. I thought it looked more like his shoulder than his arm, but it was still called as a penalty. And once our goal was disallowed, and then there was a penalty for Sevilla or Betis. You think: "For crying out loud, I understand it's difficult, but sometimes I really don't know why."

Because they explain it to us, and then a week later there's an opposite decision. You think: "Okay, we don't need to sit here for an hour listening to them explain the new rule, this rule, that rule, and then a week later there's another decision." Sometimes it's really hard to understand. But I still have to say I respect everyone's work. At the end of the day, if a decision goes against you, you feel it's unfair. If it goes your way, you think: "Okay, that's it, case closed."

Of course it's not easy. For example, in England and Spain, there are two cases happening now. During your time at Chelsea, Manchester City FC was accused by the Premier League of over 100 financial violations between 2009 and 2018, which covered four of your Premier League seasons. Pochettino spoke about this recently—he was a Premier League manager at that time. Do you think this issue affected other teams? You were Chelsea's goalkeeper at that time.

No, as a player, I didn't feel affected by it. But of course, if you can increase your revenue, you can sign more or better players, which in some ways affects the competition because ultimately you're building a stronger team. Of course, their victories on the pitch came from their own performances, and I'm not denying that. Everything they won, they won on the pitch. No problem there. But the fact is that without those things, perhaps some players wouldn't have been there. So it's hard to say.

I myself won the Premier League twice. In my second season, we finished 10th, and in my final year with Conte, I remember we should have finished 3rd or 4th. So it didn't have a particular effect on me, but we still have to wait for the verdict to find out what really happened. That's it. I can't comment further. I think those who should comment have already voiced their opinions, and I think Manchester City FC should appeal. It's not over yet.

There has been a ruling, but no final penalty yet. And there hasn't even been a ruling in the Negreira case. Do Real Madrid players or players from other teams talk about these matters?

No, not really. Sometimes people joke about it casually, but it's not really something we discuss seriously anymore. At the end of the day, everyone is just waiting for the verdict. Because it's a very serious matter. I think the same way. I hope there will be a ruling soon. There should be a result by now.

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